Interview with an Art Hoarder

What was the first artwork which you purchased?

BREAK by John Kushmaul 1999 (@johnkushmaul). It was framed and a bargain at approximately $150. It has since hung everywhere I have moved. 

Are you more interested in emerging or renowned artists?

I’m more interested in renowned artists. My budget is more interested in emerging artists. I love to find an artist before they’ve made it or even before they have gallery representation. I like to get in early. If you’ve ever seen the documentary Herb And Dorothy, about the Vogels, they are my art heroes — art stacked in every nook and cranny of their NYC apartment. An absolute dream. 

How has social media changed your collection?  

I now learn about most artists through Instagram. But, when I first started looking at art in 1999, it was just local art galleries and whatever random small-town fair might pop up. My worldview was very limited- there was no worldview. The internet was just creaking along, a dial-up arthritic dinosaur. Then I discovered eBay. I spent hours drinking super-cheap wine and scrolling through art. I bid on a lot of art. I’d think, “$9, hell yeah I’ll bid $9 for the chance to see that” (or at least bump the price up). I had art packed everywhere, I still have a lot of it and some of it is still hanging.

(Left to right)

Andrew Salgado (@andre.salgado.art) Sad Tommy, 2015, BEERS LONDON

AL Resnick, 1983 Edward Michael Casey, EBAY

Al Resnick was the longest resident of Casa Casuarina, a grungy 3-story apartment complex in Miami until the building was bought by Gianni Versace, restored, and turned into the Versace Mansion. The eBay listing had pictures of the artist in his apartment on the couch with his paintings covering the walls; it also warned that the building had been tented and treated for a termite infestation and there was evidence of termite damage on some of the pieces. Indeed, there was some termite damage and they all smelled of cigarettes. I love his work and can’t find anything on him with a Google search. I don’t want him to be forgotten. So, here are a couple of more.

In 2010, the end of my dabbling in EBAY - I bought a reproduction of Repin’s Reply of the Zaporozhian Cossacks from Kyiv for under $200. I didn’t pay attention to the dimensions (see previous wine comment). It arrived in a giant tube, and I was like “What is this? I didn’t purchase a carpet.” It was ginormous and in terrible shape, I cleaned cement powder and cigarette tar off of it with a wet clean white T-shirt. It now takes up an entire wall of our bedroom.

(Left to right)

Master copy of Repin -Reply of the Zaporozhian by V. Koshevoy 1952XX

Johan Barrios (@johanbarrios) Accumulacìon, 2017 from Anya Tish Gallery

Then I transitioned to magazines - New American Paintings and American Art Collector. American Art Collector is where I first saw Andrea Kowch. Her work was all I could think about. I kept emailing Richard Demato at RJD Gallery about her, but there was nothing available. He finally sold me something, maybe because he saw how in love I was with her work or maybe so I would just leave him alone. 

Open Window, 2015 Andrea Kowch, RJD Gallery

When I first discovered ARTSY, it was like upscale eBay, and again I was stuck at my computer for hours. I’d start at Recently Added and scroll through until I reached the art from my previous visit.

But the real game changer for me was Instagram. There have been numerous occasions where an artist has posted a painting they were still working on or had just finished, and I’m like hey, hey, hello, look at me, excuse me, where is this piece going? Many times I’ve enquired about it before the gallery has received or maybe even seen it. This happened with the Brad Kunkle painting WEAVER. I’d followed Brad’s progress on the painting and then a pic of it finished, still on the easel, popped up on Instagram on 4/14/2016. I immediately emailed Steve at Arcadia Contemporary. Several years later I was watching Netflix’s Anne With An E and was shocked to see Weaver pop up in the opening salvo. It was pretty exciting.

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A post shared by Brad Kunkle (@bradrkunkle)

Weaver, 2016 Brad Kunkle (@bradrkunkle) 2016 from Arcadia Contemporary

For a while, Weaver hung next to a painting I had previously acquired by Casey Baugh of Brad Kunkle in a leather jacket. Which I found very pleasing.

Braille to the Night (cropped) 2015 by Casey Baugh from Arcadia Gallery

Or sometimes I’ll screenshot an IG post and message it to the gallery and enquire that way. 

Woman with Fan and Caryatid Vessel, 2018 Jonathan Chapline (@jchapline) The Hole

Sometimes, I’m fortunate enough to visit an artist in their studio and  have bought work that way. I once texted a selfie of myself, my husband, Shaun Downey, and his wife (also a great painter) in front of one of the paintings in his studio to the gallery owner - “Hey Steve, I want this, please.”

I recently bought an unfinished work from Amy Werntz (@amywerntz_art) when I visited her studio. Amy does amazing, I mean amazing work. Two of my favorite paintings of hers are held by my nemesis, The Bennet Collection. If you have a chance to see them, do. Just kidding about the nemesis part.  But, The Bennet Collection also has my two favorite Andrea Kowch paintings, so there is maybe a little truth in that.

What is your ultimate goal for your collection?

That most of it would stay together and go to the permanent collection of a museum that loved it as much as I do. It’s arrogant to think that, but the work is all pretty new and I think it will hold up over time. Once, someone on Instagram called me a modern-day Frick. Which is the best compliment I’ve ever received.

Or, if the art could stay in the house after I’m dead, my husband of course lives on long after me, remarries an average-looking but very nice guy, and then finally when they both croak, the house turns into a small local museum run by fitness models and bartenders. That would be dreamy, too. 

Who is an artist you let get away and now are unable to collect?

Kehinde Wiley - hand to forehead. I saw his work around 2009 in a Magazine — The Advocate maybe? Two groovy men with glorious afros in a background of flowers. I immediately emailed the gallery. The work in the magazine was already sold, but they sent me an image of another painting that was still available. ( I searched my old AOL email, but couldn’t find it) It was good, but I was not as in love with it as the one in the magazine. And, the price would have depleted ninety-five percent of my savings. (The painting is probably worth more than 20 times that now) It seemed fiscally irresponsible, so I begrudgingly declined and used the money to work on paying off debt. Now, I can’t walk by a Wiley in a museum without gritting my teeth to suppress the screams from escaping my head. If only I had seen that 1999 Wiley in person, I might have done it. 

How has collecting changed for you through the years?

When I first started collecting, If I saw something I liked and I could afford it I bought it. Now, I first go and check out all the other works of that artist and make sure that the work I like is not a one-off. 

There is also now a space crisis. If I like the work, there has to be space, or I have to be able to move stuff around to make space. 

I’m slowing down at work, so my resources and space will soon be depleted. My fantasy would be to transition to collecting for someone else, curate a show, or be hired to inject life into the Momentary in Bentonville, AR - an amazing space and a great concept but something that never lived up to the modern art fantasy I had when it was first announced. 

Which artwork in history has inspired you the most?

Géricault’s “The Raft of the Medusa.” It’s a gigantic oil painting that has everything for me - beauty, drama, movement, a story, darkness, emotion, perfect structure, and execution. I went straight to it in the Louvre so if I  were to have dropped dead in the next hour and saw nothing else, I would have seen it. 

I just have to say Wyeth’s Christina’s World does the same for me for the same reasons. I also love it so much.

Is there any particular type of art that has consistently attracted you, or anything that unites all the works you have acquired?

Mostly figurative works with emotion and movement that suggest an underlying story. And the occasional hot dude that does most of the above.

Anna in Gold, 2021 by Mary Sauer (@marysauerart), Arcadia Contemporary

Untitled, Taner Yilmaz  (@tnrylmaz), Artist’s studio

The Nameless Queen, Stephanie Rew (@stephrew), Thompson Gallery

Afternoon, 2019 Jeffrey Chong Wang, Arcadia Contemporary

Reflections, Jeffrey Chong Wang (@Jeffrey_Chong_Wang), Arcadia Contemporary

Solstice, 2016 Jordan Sokol (@jordan_sokol), Arcadia Contemporary

Which artists are on your radar to collect in the near future?

If I have collected an artist's work, I will talk nonstop about them. I will promote them. I’ll tell anyone who will listen how great they are.

If someone is on my radar? You won’t hear a peep from me. I’m not about to create demand and drive prices up. Unless they were, upon birth, immediately out of my price range. I’m looking at you, Salman Toor.

Who is your art crush?

If I could go back in time I wouldn’t say no to a throuple with Francis Bacon and Lucian Freud. Don’t tell my husband. 

Seriously though, I would say every artist in my collection is an art crush. If they had any idea how many paintings I scroll through every day, and something made me stop and fixate on their work they would, they should, blush. Blush and then run because the stalk is on. 

I enjoy having the opportunity to meet the artists in my collection. I’ve more recently started taking a selfie with them and taping it to the back of the painting. I think that will be a fun discovery for someone in the future. I kick myself that I didn’t start it sooner. 

Superman Has Feelings, Too, 2021 Tania Rivilis (tania_rivilis)

Afterlife/Osiris, 2016 Andrew Salgado (@andrew.salgado.art) Beers London

Self Portrait #144, 2004 Philip Akkerman (@philip_akkerman) Richard Heller Gallery

Self Portrait #117, 2001 Philip Akkerman (@philip_akkerman) Richard Heller Gallery

Robinson, 2020 Bruno Leydet (@brunoleydetmtl) Craven Contemporary

Hotel Borgne, 2020 Bruno Leydet, Craven Contemporary

Made in the Image of God, 2017 Michael Reeder (@reederone) Thinkspace

Back to crush. It is dumfounding to me that when people come to our house they don’t see the work and immediately have the same crush. 

Look at the light on that Downey. He is a freaking modern-day Vermeer. Stop and look right now, the glow on her face and the lace of her dress. Apologize to Shaun, for not paying attention to what is going on right in front of your face. 

Binoculars, 2018 Shaun Downey (@shaundowneyart) from Arcadia Contemporary

How did you just walk past that Sarazhin and not stop, mouth gaped wide, and give your best Pavlovian dopamine drool? Look at those confident brush strokes and the movement and tension between him and his wife. Yes, that is him and his wife. She is an amazing artist, too. It’s all right there and you just strolled by. Open your eyes.

One Moment of Silence, 2016 Denis Sarazhin  (@denis_sarazhin) Arcadia Contemporary

Excuse me. Don’t just halfway glance at that Ortega. Get up close and look at it. You know he sets up an entire model town with little model houses, trees, people, cars, gets the lighting just right, and then paints the whole damn thing. There’s a YouTube video about it, but you probably haven’t even bothered to check. Isn’t it amazing? Say it’s amazing or get out of my house.

In a Strange Land, 2022 Alberto Ortega (@alberto_ortega_paintings)

Those are paint chips arranged by hue. Don’t just stand still. It’s meant to be interactive. You have to move around to get all the views. It changes with the light and your perspective.

OLPH 2, 2015 by Peter Combe (@petercombe_art) Robert Fontaine gallery

Samuel Peralta

Dr. Samuel Peralta founded the Lunar Codex, archiving the works of over 30,000 artists, writers, musicians, and filmmakers from 156 countries on the Moon, in tandem with NASA’s Artemis program. He is an award-winning physicist, a Wall Street Journal and USA Today bestselling author, a Grandes Figuras awarded composer and lyricist, and a producer of Golden Globe-nominated and Emmy-winning films. He has curated exhibits with PoetsArtists, 33 Contemporary Gallery, the Zhou B Art Center, and the Wausau Museum of Contemporary Art. He and his wife are named sponsors of the permanent Yayoi Kusama room at the Art Gallery of Ontario. And he cooks a killer penne alla boscaiola.

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Q&A

What made you want to start collecting art? 

My parents were both visual artists; and while my father gravitated to writing plays, my mother continues painting and sculpting to this day. Growing up, my brothers and I were surrounded by art, not only by works created by our mother and father, but also paintings, drawings, and prints of other artists that they were close friends with.  

Oil and acrylic, terracotta and metal, works by Rosario B. Peralta (Photo credit: R. Go)

My parents were artists who evolved into being collectors, and a similar evolution happened with me. I wasn’t a visual artist – at the time I wrote mainly poetry and essays – but that love of art they instilled in me manifested itself in my collecting one piece, then another, and then a few more. Later, I found my love of art reflected in my lifelong partner, and that mutual love evolved into a shared passion for collecting.

What was the first artwork which you purchased?

A piece by the Philippine artist Mauro Santos, known professionally as ‘Malang’. I was just beginning university studies, and I saw his work at one of the regular art exhibitions I went to with my parents, an outing as usual for our family as going to the movies. I’d won a scholarship to university that included a personal allowance, and if I remember right, I spent most of my first-year allowance on that watercolor, a realist work that verged on the abstract, called “Coming Storm.” I was hooked. 

Coming Storm (1978) Mauro ‘Malang’ Santos

Are you more interested in emerging or renowned artists?

It’s a balance of both. It’s always a thrill to have the chance to collect the work of an artist that’s generally known and admired. After all, they are part of the reason I appreciate the art I do now.

Seated Woman III Dark Room (1974) Henry Moore

On the other hand, there is the thrill of collecting artists that you feel should be perhaps more universally well known than they are. And when you hang the works of these emerging artists on the wall, alongside the work of acknowledged masters, or talk about these works in the same breath, comparing themes and technique, concepts and color palettes, it’s almost as if you make it so.

Pilot Girl 39 (2022) Kathrin Longhurst

Who is an artist you let get away and now are unable to collect?

In the mid-80s I was in the United Kingdom as a graduate student working on my doctorate in physics. I fell in love with the works of David Hockney. At the time was experimenting with what he saw as a new type of printing machine – in reality, a friend’s photocopying machine. 

The ‘home-made prints’ he produced disrupted the color printmaking process and were – relatively speaking – affordable. As a student on a grant, I decided that saving for a trip to Italy with friends and for regular (expensive!) phone calls home was more practical than what were essentially photocopies. Oh, what a missed opportunity! 

Afternoon Swimming (1980) David Hockney

Have you sold any of your works at auction? 

Auctions are essentially theatrical, and so we enjoy viewing and attending these. While we’ve purchased from auctions, we haven’t sold anything yet – but we are readying some works for auction in the future. Among these earmarked for auctions are two lithographs by a Canadian master, Alex Colville. One, “Berlin Bus,” we acquired at a German auction and repatriated; and the other, “Target Shooting,” at a Canadian liquidation auction. We love these works, but they are duplicates of works we already have, and it will soon be time for someone else to enjoy them.

Berlin Bus (1993), Alex Colville

What current trends are you following and why?

Ai Weiwei is opening a new show at London’s Design Museum. It includes a piece called “Water Lilies #1” – a massive, 50-foot-wide piece based on Claude Monet’s water lilies, re-created with 650,000 Lego bricks. It’s not his first piece in what’s been called the “industrial language” of Lego bricks. In the late 2000s, he began using Lego bricks to create portraits of political prisoners and exiles, collected in a 2014 exhibition.

Water Lilies #1 (2023) Ai Weiwei. (Photo credit: Ela Bialkowska/OKNO studio) 

He isn’t the only one using Lego bricks instead of brushstrokes or traditional mosaic pieces to create masterworks – in effect, rendering realist work using a modernist idiom. An increasing number of artists are exploring this pathway to realist art, and it will be interesting to see how far they push this concept.

Emerald Girl (2017) Paulina Aubey

Have you ever been disappointed by an artist?

Yes – myself. I’ve always wanted to be a visual artist, but a few years ago I decided I was perhaps better off as a poet and author. I’ve experimented with abstract works in the style of Piet Mondrian. In one of these fevered states, I purchased a large, flipboard-presentation-style pad of graph paper and on one sheet began coloring in the squares with Mondrian colors – red, green, blue, yellow, white – with each color determined by the roll of a pair of dice. It was an intense undertaking, meditative and even spiritual at times. I was pleased with the result, presenting it to my parents as a gift. 

I did a few other pieces in this manner, but a couple of years later, I looked at that original RGBY piece again and a feeling of massive disappointment overcame me – so much so that I’ve never again tried my hand at visual art since then. 

Until now.

Moonstone (2021) Samuel Peralta

Carmen Nelon

How did you get start collecting art?
I have always had a love for art, as far back as I can remember. Art classes during my school years were always my favorite. I studied art and art history in college. But, ended up getting a degree in education, and teaching art for a short period of time. In my early 20's I walked into an estate sale in Godley, Texas. A man had traveled the world buying art, and his farm house walls were covered in art. I bought some of my first pieces at this sale, including two original, signed Miro lithographs. I became hooked treasure hunting for art.

What was your first purchase?
A Salvador Dali etching I found at a Goodwill in 1986.

What type of art do you lean towards collecting?
I love and appreciate all types of art. However, I am really into Texas artists, particularly Texas female artists, and artists that were a part of the "Fort Worth Circle". I am also very into illustration art.

Which are some of your favorite pieces from the collection?
I have so many favorites! I guess some of my favorites are two large Philipe Noyer mid century oil paintings, dated 1957. I purchased them from the estate of the original owners, who traveled to Paris in 1958, purchased them at a gallery there, and had them shipped to their home in Oklahoma. Also, I love my J.C. Leyendecker study of one of his Saturday Evening Post covers. One recent purchase I love is John Hyland's portrait of Amanda Gorman, "Ray Of Light".

What advice do you have for anyone who would like to start an art collection?
Think of collecting art as in investment. Buy original pieces, even if you can only afford the smaller pieces by certain artists. Buy pieces you love, that speak to you.

Which is your latest acquisition?
John Hyland's "Till We're Together II", a beautiful portrait of Marilyn Monroe.

Who are some of the artists you wish to add to your collection?
Tim Okamura! I have been following him since I saw the documentary, Heavyweight Paint, a few years ago, at the Modern Art Museum of Fort Worth. I first saw some of his pieces at Fort Works Arts Gallery, following the documentary. I love his work. I also love O’Neil Scott’s work! His portrait of Tim Okamura is awesome! I love it when artists paint other artists! Another artist I discovered watching the documentary, "Heavyweight Paint" was Jerome Lagarrigue.

Do you have any regrets?
I have three regrets!

One was selling my two Miro Lithographs a year or two after I bought them. I was young, and needed money. I never had them appraised, and sold them to a lady for $500.00. Thirty years later I walked into a shop in Carrizozo, New Mexico. Got into a conversation with the owner of the shop, who said she was from Fort Worth. It turns out she was the lady I sold my Miros to, in the 80's! She told me they appraised, back then, for $6000.00. And, that she had given them to her son. My second regret was being outbid on one of Tim Okamura's paintings in an online auction. The third regret was being outbid on a Clara McDonald Williamson at an estate auction, in Synder , Texas.

Elisabeth Ramfjord

“I have given advice to young women to dare to stand out and believe in their dreams and their ability to realize them, but not be too impatient about reaching their targets. I don´t see myself as any kind of hero or champion, but I have a number of situations where I have found the right balance between my own feeling of fear related to risks, and to mobilize enough courage to implement it anyway. After all, it is at the border of your comfort zone, that usually great things happen! I think that those who know me well, regard me as a risk taker, with a high pace and a great passion for my work as a gallerist. I am lucky to be able to work with something I feel a true inner motivation to succeed with, so it is not difficult for me to mobilize passion for my work. But l have to admit that it took me almost 10 years to build up the courage to say (and mean it) that l don’t care what other people think and that l will keep following my heart! Next year l will have been running the gallery for 20 years.”

— Elisabeth Ramfjord

Interviewed By Erin Anderson

EA: You are a businesswoman and an entrepreneur but you started as a creative and still foster the practice of art making in your life. What (or who) were your biggest inspirations when you were young and how did these influences help shape the direction you took later in life?

ER: When l was young l wanted to be a fashion designer and started working at a clothing store at the age of 15. The store was run by a young couple, a French designer and his wife who was a former supermodel. I got a chance to be an assistant to a designer, participate at fashion fairs and they even used me as a model. I worked for them for 3 years and they taught me almost everything l know about customer service and what it’s like to run a store. They were definitely my biggest inspiration early in my career.

EA: You designed and made clothes when you were younger. How did you want people to feel in your clothes? Do you ever find these early intentions inform and shape the artwork that you both make and are drawn to?

ER: It was a short career. I drew and made my own clothes when l was a teenager, and started out as a sort of multi-artist. I think that everything combined shaped my future works, as an artist. My aim was to convey my creativity and the customers satisfaction, which still is one of my main motivations as a gallerist. I still love the feeling of making someone happy.

The work you choose in your gallery is often reminiscent of the inner life, emotional layering and multifaceted psychological dynamics. Do you find you choose work based primarily on your emotional connection to the subject or is it a combination of factors?

I always choose artworks and artists that l love, otherwise it’s difficult to both work together with the artists, show and promote their work. It is really a balance between my rational and my sensory abilities! Nevertheless I must admit that my cognitive reaction to an artwork, often is the winner, although quality is never to be neglected. The last factor is very important to me.

EA: Do you mind sharing what artists you’ve included in your personal collection?

ER: Oh, I have several, both abstract and figurative. Just to name drop some; Lene Kilde, Aron Wiesenfeld , Alexandra Niemzcyk, Gabriel Schmitz, Ingebjørg Støyva, Audun Grimstad...

EA: The premise of the WAW show is to dedicate the exhibition to the woman who symbolizes a hero among champions. I see any female entrepreneur taking risks and succeeding in her field as a hero and a champion. What would you tell young women today about having the courage to follow their dreams?

ER: I have given advice to young women to dare to stand out and believe in their dreams and their ability to realize them, but not be too impatient about reaching their targets. I don´t see myself as any kind of hero or champion, but I have a number of situations where I have found the right balance between my own feeling of fear related to risks, and to mobilize enough courage to implement it anyway. After all, it is at the border of your comfort zone, that usually great things happen! I think that those who know me well, regard me as a risk taker, with a high pace and a great passion for my work as a gallerist. I am lucky to be able to work with something I feel a true inner motivation to succeed with, so it is not difficult for me to mobilize passion for my work. But l have to admit that it took me almost 10 years to build up the courage to say (and mean it) that l don’t care what other people think and that l will keep following my heart! Next year l will have been running the gallery for 20 years.

I will encourage others to move patiently forward with work they really feel passion for. My best advice: Work hard and be patient, success doesn’t come over night, and if it does it usually doesn’t last. Don’t undermine yourself and don’t give up when you meet resistance. Don’t team up with people with negative energy. Find your weakness and don’t be afraid to ask for help, you cannot be good at everything. And last: Be visible on social media!

EA: The depiction of a woman warrior can come in many forms, what most conveys the image of a strong woman to you?

Difficult question! I think a strong woman has the courage to be open about her own vulnerability and weakness, and despite the fact that not everybody else loves to see you succeed, fights her own fear and brings forward courage to move on in the direction of her dreams. A strong woman doesn’t get too affected by others, but dares to believe in her own capabilities and dreams.

It takes considerable determination and grit to start any business from the ground up let alone a successful gallery business. Has it ever seemed difficult to be a strong woman in a world culture where traditional female gender roles often prevail?

ER: Starting a business is risky anyhow, for both men and women, but you have to have a strong belief in your own capabilities. And be able to work hard and truly believe in what you do. I really don´t see any limitations regarding traditional female gender to show more self confidence, although I have great respect for women who choose the more traditional role in life.

EA: As a gallery owner and an artist, what advice do you have for artists who are getting started in their careers?

ER: As mentioned, I would encourage them to believe in their work and show great passion. Be patient. Define your style and what you want to express, and always try to develop yourself, so you don´t risk stagnation. Work hard and don’t give up, take a NO with pride and keep working even if it is difficult. The “stayers” are the ones that often make success in the end. Establish a relationship with a gallerist or agent who wishes to contribute to your success, with marketing and introduction to collectors and galleries internationally. Stay visible, if not in public, be visible in social media!

EA: Do you find the personal balance between entrepreneur and creative difficult? Are there ever times where the pull to satisfy one or the other is distracting or is it a more synergistic dynamic?

ER: The balance is always difficult, mainly because time is a limited resource. But I am happy to have a background as an artist to be able to have a “tribal language” with the artists and better understand their struggle and wishes. I always Wish l had more time to paint though....it’s a kind of meditation for me!

PA87

$15.00

Howard Tullman

WM: How many paintings are in your collection and what percentage of them are nudes of some kind?

HT: About 1500 paintings and 65% are nudes of some kind. (975 paintings in the collection are nudes.)

WM: Why are nudes such a focus in your collection?

HT: I think it’s the hardest thing to paint or draw, the human body, that’s one of the reasons. You can get away with a lot if you are doing a landscape, a building, but I think we know instantly if someone has done an accurate reproduction of a human face or body. So that’s why it’s always been of interest to me.

WM: We recognize that “uncanny valley” and immediately notice if a person looks asymmetrical or somehow wrongly put together.

HT: Honestly, we are all asymmetrical so what’s really interesting is that the artist has to make it look correct without symmetry because nobody’s face is identically the same on both sides.

WM. Do other people think it’s odd that such a large part of your collection is nudes? Do you get that reaction?

HT: I don’t usually discuss the percentage. When anyone comes to where we show the work there are a fair number of nudes among the paintings but there’s hundreds of paintings and it’s not as if you walk from room to room and all you see is nudes. There’s a lot of other stuff, there’s a painting of a woman’s head that’s nine feet tall, there are giant Japanese screens and many sculptures. There’s just about anything you can imagine. It’s all figurative and it’s all contemporary but it’s not limited to nudes.

WM: Have you ever wanted to collect any non-contemporary nudes?

HT: We only really buy living artists, we want to support living artists and that’s always been our focus. I don’t have an interest in historical nudes.

WM: The nudes in your collection cover a vast array of styles from comic book campy to hyper-realism. Not many collectors are so diverse. What’s your guideline?

HT: I’m not sure I have any comic book nudes, with the single possible exception of a Peter Saul nude that is so distorted you wouldn’t immediately think of it as a nude. Most of the work that we have is either literal, photo-realistic or narrative. I think that is the range. There’s some stuff that might be considered graphic art. The collection became as broad as it is because after a while all the hyper-realism started to get a little boring and the narrative art felt more interesting, that’s what drove it.

WM: Often, the nude gets tangled up in politics and censorship; it gets called pornography or blasted by political correctness. There is a lot of cultural effort in America to suppress nudity despite freedom of speech. Your thoughts on that?

HT: I’m discouraged that a lot of really good artists aren’t taking advantage of the broad distribution possibilities of the internet and how inexpensive it is to get their work seen, because of exactly that censorship issue. It’s not as big an issue or concern for me personally, because we have multiple venues our homes, where I work, my loft and my other office. So we have five venues. One of the ways I address people’s anxieties about nudity is not to force it, for example in our business office we have a very diverse group, two thousand people a day come through. I wouldn’t subject them to all my choices in art. But in our homes or the art loft, that’s a different situation. Censorship hasn’t really impacted me, but I am concerned about how sometimes I will send an article around; for example Jenny Morgan just had a good magazine review and one of the images was a nude self-portrait and I had a moment’s angst about putting it on Facebook because some of these bozos on Facebook get concerned and over-react. It is an issue. I don’t know how it’s going to be resolved, but it’s certainly not going to get resolved by the government. It has not been something that has directly impacted me.

WM: You’ve been smart — or sensitive — about where to display your nudes.

HT: I’m not trying to make a statement or offend anyone. This is art that I love. Keep in mind, we have more art in this genre than any museum in the world, and making it available to art students is very significant to me. We do this on a regular basis. We have classes of art students come to the loft because they aren’t going to see these examples in their own museums or schools. The museums, by and large, are pretty modest about how much nudity they will display on a regular basis. And museums have very few contemporary realist nudes.

WM: I was at a group exhibition at a prestigious small museum in California, and there were a few nudes in the show catalog. But when I got there, nothing on the walls. I asked one of the organizers and they said they didn’t want to hang art that made anyone uncomfortable.

HT: It’s unbelievable. It’s very strange.

WM: It’s sexual repression. Sometimes nudes are “sexy” — and then sometimes they are just people without any clothes on. Do you find either of these approaches more interesting or productive as a collector?

HT: I don’t have a lot of nudes where the artist went out of their way to make the nude sexy or erotic. Not because I have consciously avoided it, I just don’t feel there are many in the collection like that.

WM: There have been some art collectors, like Charles Martignette, that amassed very large collections of sexy pin-up style art.

HT: Those to me are illustration, not really fine art nudes.

WM: Having made the collecting of nudes such a focus for many years, what do you look for in a nude now?

HT: I look for something now that has execution, is narrative, something that viscerally appeals to me. We don’t buy just to have reference works.

WM: What does it reveal about an artist’s psychology by the way they paint a nude?

HT: Very often I buy work and later meet the artist but I rarely meet the artist in advance. I’ve been shocked at how typical, normal and every day-ish some of the artists are who do some of the most radical work. I think of Nadine Robbins, Victoria Selbach, or Terri Thomas. These people if you met them on the street you wouldn’t think they did nude art or portraits in the nude. I can’t know by looking at any five pieces if an artist is an exhibitionist or terribly distraught. On the other hand Matthew Cherry, he has in his art been really involved in telling the story of many things he’s been going through and his emotional feelings, also how his life continues to change.

WM: Do you feel that when an artist is doing a nude they are letting their wild side come out?

HT: There are a few instances of that, but if you meet the artist, you might discover that wildness was something you read into the work.

WM: I’m thinking of Suzy Smith who could play an All-American mom on TV, but paints pop art nudes.

HT: I think she comes across as a normal suburban housewife, and yet if you looked at her artwork, objectively, you’d say that looks pretty close to beauty-pageant porn. It’s right at the margin.

WM: When any artist, male or female, paints a nude some judgement gets put on it that’s always unfair. If men paint women they are objectifying. If men paint men they are gay. If women paint women they are lesbian. I promised “no censorship” in this issue and I was surprised at how many male nudes were submitted for consideration. A large number.

HT: People ask me all the time why I don’t have more Mapplethorpes or nudes of men. And the truth is there is not that much being done with male nudes in the whole space and even if there were I am not sure I’d find it as attractive or challenging. Some of most interesting nudes I see now are paintings of elderly men and women, amazing work, not focused on the body but on older faces which are remarkable.

Interviewed by Walt Morton May 30, 2017
Chicago, Illinois

View of the Tullman Collection Loft, Chicago
Photography by Gregory Rothstein

Billy Hunt

Tell us a little bit about your collection. What do you focus on in art and artists? You've really designed your living space around your art collection. How did you get started as an art collector, and how did art-collecting come to play such a dominant role in your life?

My art collection today really began in 1999, which coincided with my divorce and the new opportunity to decorate my home exactly as I wished, and the financial means to accomplish what I wished. The subjects of all the paintings are women, and most of them are nudes. I suppose my divorce had an impact on that choice, as well. Once the real, three-dimensional woman with the warmth of her company was gone, I replaced her with two-dimensional illusions of real women. As for warmth and companionship, all I need is those paintings and a little imagination, but if that fails, there is always my cat, Lady Macbeth. 

I started buying art in earnest around the early 1990s. I was on a limited budget and bought art from local artists at street fairs and the like. The amounts I paid ranged from $50 to about $750. I was horribly stingy and negotiated the prices down mercilessly. My shame and guilt from that time still haunts me today. So now, when I want to purchase a painting from an artist, I simply ask them the price at which they will happily part with their work. Not lottery-winner stupid happy, mind you, but happy nonetheless, and I tell them I will not try to negotiate the price down because it is demeaning to both the artist and to me. When dealing with galleries, I still sometimes negotiate, because they have a sizable profit margin. Most of the art from that early period I have given away. It just didn't fit in with the work I purchase now. 

Toward the end of the 1990s I began to notice the work of artists trained at the intensive academies or self-taught in the classical tradition, and while the prices were much higher than I was accustomed to paying, the power and beauty of the art was overwhelming. Starting in college, I thought that modern art, particularly from 1890 until the late 1930s, was the greatest art ever painted. But seeing this contemporary art caused me to revalue classical representational painting relative to modern art. For me, the final surrender of modern art occurred in, of all places, Las Vegas in 1999, at an exhibition of the billionaire Steve Wynn's collection. Paintings by masters of modern art were hung side-by-side with old masters, and I felt the modern paintings deflate like old tires. The first expensive (for me) painting I purchased was in 1999 at Ann Nathan's gallery in Chicago. It was a large canvas whose  subject was four female nudes. The price was $10,000, and Ann sized me up and declared that the frame of that painting probably cost more than any painting I had bought previously. If you know Ann, you know she can be judgmental, but in my case, sadly, she was dead right. 

Several paintings from the collection.

Pam Hawkes, Carla Crawford, and others.

After that I kept adding nudes to my collection, always realist and by artists with exceptional training, but the gender of the artist was not a factor in my decisions, until maybe the last eight years, when I have chosen to specialize further to paintings of women by women artists. The Women Painting Women series of exhibitions had nothing to do with my choice. I was very late to obtain the most basic computer literacy, and I had no knowledge of those exhibits until recently. Rather, it was a gradual realization that I generally preferred the female perspective on the female nude to that of a man. Sometimes, it is simply that male painters overly sexualize their models, even unconsciously. And while women artists aren't immune from sexualizing their models every bit as much as men, the fact that the painting was conceived by a woman (funny how that just came out...), makes the sexualization less predatory in my mind. I suspect most philosophy majors in college could easily tear my last argument apart.

My living space preceded the art collection—it was the townhouse I bought to accommodate my girlfriend, her two children from a previous marriage, me, and two cats. The walls always had paintings, but there was more wall than there was art. When we got divorced about 12 years later, she didn't want the place; so, I kept it as it was convenient to shopping and public transportation (I like Chicago's CTA, and I absolutely love New York's MTA. If you go by what you read in the newspapers, I am alone in my feelings for the NYC subway). I always said, half-jokingly, that your home should resemble the inside of your mind. Once I was alone, I set about doing just that. I did a lot of decorative things myself on the walls and ceilings with Thai unryu paper, acrylic paint, and glass, and then I filled every square inch of wall space with art. First-time visitors are overwhelmed—it is just too much art to take in at once and appreciate, 150 or so paintings, but I live with them, and they are like old friends to me. Just imagine if the Metropolitan Museum of Art rented out the open central spaces in all their galleries. You could have a bed, a bathtub, and a dresser; sorry, no stove, you have to go out to eat. How great would that be! Well, maybe not so great for the museum's patrons, but for me it would be heaven. That was the idea behind my home, minus the priceless art. I have spent far more on the art in my home than on purchasing the home itself. I really need to remodel the kitchen and bathrooms, but I can't bear the dust and disturbance to the paintings. Everyone has to make compromises in life; that is mine.

Paintings by Aleah Chapin, Kimberly Dow, Rose Freymuth-Frazier, and others

Daniel Maidman hanging in the kitchen.

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Do you play any other roles in the arts? What relationship are you interested in developing or maintaining with artists and the art world?

I am involved with a Chicago theater ensemble that presents avant-garde, mostly European plays. I support contemporary dance companies, and one of the opera companies in Chicago. And I buy as much art as I can, more than I have space for. What bothers me about collecting art is that once a painting moves into my home, it is seen by relatively few people. Paintings are extroverts, even if their creators are not. They need to mingle with people and try to seduce them. My paintings are more akin to restive nuns in a convent, struggling against their narrow confinement. I have a running joke with Patty Watwood, whose home is filled with her nudes and they are for sale, that she is not an artist, but rather a madam in a nineteenth-century brothel, and I am a lecherous old man of good taste, with a fine reputation among women of ill repute.

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What moves you in a piece of work? How do you decide that you love a piece enough you need to invite it to come live with you?

The paintings I want to live with have certain things in common—they are of women, for the most part of women that are generally viewed as attractive, and for the most part nude. I realize this sounds crass and objectifying and exploitative, but it would be dishonest of me to claim some purely higher ground to my preferences in art. However, there are many paintings of attractive, nude women out there, yet only a few interest me. So it goes far deeper than the crude laws of attraction and desire. Sometimes, it is the craftsmanship, or the pose of the model, an expression captured by the artist, or something missing in the model that begs questions and discomfort. A painting of a nude needs to provoke as well as seduce. I like to know what an artist specifically has in mind when creating a painting. Whenever I hear an artist say, "There is no right answer, it's open to the viewer's interpretation," I think, that's total bullshit, a cop-out, and I have no interest in the work. I avoid anything that strikes me as merely pin-up material. I have noticed certain repeated themes in my collecting - water and baths, pregnancy and annunciation, the story of Eve, reflections and mirrors. Beyond that, whatever drives my passion, or anybody's for that matter, remains elusive.

I’d like to add an aside to this. It is a feature I perceive as a trend in the painting of nudes; actually, it may be a trend throughout American society. It is the absence of pubic hair on female nudes. This is not in the least a thumbs up or thumbs down factor when I view a painting. More of a curiosity, with an added darker dimension in the distant background. What has happened to pubic hair on women? Why did it disappear? It has become, it seems, an endangered species. National Geographic should do a documentary, "Vanishing Pubic Hair in the Midsection of America." I get that for artists it makes work easier, not having to render all those troublesome little hairs, and we are about 500 years past the point of fig leaves. Maybe it makes a woman feel younger or better about herself. There is something more to the question, and it troubles me. Perhaps I'm getting too Freudian here, but I think a little part of the urge of women to remove their pubic hair, and especially the urge of men to want women to do so, relates to the male fantasy of being with an underage, pre-pubescent girl. A pleasant article about an art collection has no call to delve into dark regions of the mind, but I have to bring this up, even if I am the only one who perceives it in this way. I look forward to the time when the fashion returns to a more naturally adorned vulva.

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Tell us a little bit about a few favorite pieces in your collection—maybe how you encountered them, or what you learned from them, or what they mean to you. Our readers will understand that talking about piece A doesn't mean you don't also love piece B.

Two paintings pop into mind, their acquisition a glimmer of good fortune, the benevolence of the Gods of art. They are Hot Chocolate by Lee Price (a woman in a milky bath holding a bowl of hot chocolate topped with marshmallows), and Love Lost by Mavis Smith, who paints exclusively in egg tempera (a nude woman staring blankly, not quite at the viewer, with a small, repeated script—love lost—running across the painting behind her as she holds a saw in her hand. I'm not making this up). Both paintings were my favorites of the artists' work, I think their best work, and both were already sold. Then something miraculous happened —both became available again within a short time of each other. Mavis received the painting back from its buyer, and Lee's painting was returned to the gallery, Evoke Contemporary, and exchanged for another. I still marvel over the fortuitous blessing.

Lee Price | Hot Chocolate

Mavis Smith | Love Lost

Painting by Patricia Watwood

Paintings by Lee Price and others.

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What artists are you tracking? What are you looking for in art these days?

I'm not sure what you mean by "tracking". Is that a social media device? I'm not on any social media. I refuse to sign up for Facebook or its step-child Instagram. Most of the artists I like use these sites extensively; so, I miss out on current doings. I have about ninety artist websites bookmarked into my tablet and follow their work that way. The internet has made finding art and artists that I like vastly more efficient. Ten or so years ago, I had to visit galleries and the once yearly Chicago International Art Exposition (now Expo). In the course of a year, I might view 150-200 paintings of the genre I collect. Now, I can do that in a couple hours. 

Let me start by mentioning the artists I have multiple works by, in alphabetical order: Corey Bond, David Bowers, Carla Crawford, Christian Fagerlund, Ken Freed, Rose Freymuth-Frazier, Tracey Harris, Pam Hawkes, Steven Kenny, Laura Krifka, Daniel Maidman, Lorraine Sack, Camie Salaz, Mavis Smith, Bruno Surdo, Nathalie Vogel, Patricia Watwood, the Dutch artists Cas Waterman and Caroline Westerhout, Chie Yoshii, and Genevive Zacconi. Heavy on the New York accent!

Some great painters that I have only one work by barely need mentioning to realist figurative collectors: Assael, Bowland, Sprick, Monks, Chapin, Ansell, Sprung, Vinson, Lucasiewicz. Painters that deserve a wider audience: Kate Stone, Anna Wypych, Casey Krawczyk, and Kimberly Dow. Finally, painters who have given up art to make a living—I wish they would come back—Nathalie Vogel, Noh Enjeong, and Tara Juneau.

Kimberly Dow | THE NEW NUDE 2018 (catalog) | Online Exclusive from Zhou B Art Center

Viktoria Savenkova | Painting The Figure Now 2018 (catalog) | PoetsArtists Exhibition at Wausau Museum of Contemporary Art

Aleah Chapin | Visions of Venus/Venus’ Visions curated by Dr. Elaine Melotti Schmidt | PoetsArtists Exhibition at Zhou B Art Center, Chicago

Visions of Venus/Venus’ Visions Artsy | Print | PDF

Painting The Figure Now Print | PDF

THE NEW NUDE Artsy | Print | PDF

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What are your hopes for art, in itself and in its relation to society at large?

I can't imagine the sullenness of living without art—fine art, film, theater, dance, and music. I'm lucky, and I'm spoiled; for many people, art is a luxury, not a necessity. I am by my nature and by my business of risk-taking not a pessimist, but acutely aware of all the things that can go wrong with any endeavor; so, I approach the world, both the real world and the world of ideas, with caution. Here are my cautionary thoughts on the place of art in a challenging world.

We live in a time of government cutbacks in funding for the arts (and schools, healthcare, streets, sewers, and subways, but that is another story). Foundations are taking up the slack, and I'm cautiously optimistic on that. The expanding income inequality of the nation is mirrored in the art market price inequality, where a relative handful of artists and their galleries capture the lion's share of the money spent on art. The same people who are behind the one are behind the other—the hedge fund billionaires, the corporate titans, the internet disrupters, the inherited rich. I'm not condemning the extremely successful, not in the least. They work incredibly hard and they are very smart, with the possible exception of the last category I mentioned. Perhaps they aren't aware of the long-term damage to the spirit of people left in the wake of their yachts. 

They pay advisors and curators to assemble a collection for them, competing with each other for the same artists. Art is a place to park some of their money. They are buying a financial investment and buying cultural respectability, while painting over their cultural ignorance (pun intended). It is a testament to human hope that so many talented artists strive to be heard, to be seen, in the face of these odds, but the path from painter to painter making a living from art is extremely difficult. 

Another concern of mine is related to the debacle faced by musicians and filmmakers over the ease of digital reproduction of their copyrighted material. There will come a time when printing technology will permit anyone with a hi-res image to construct a near-perfect facsimile of an oil painting on canvas or board (not simply a good print on paper). What then, for contemporary artists? Will they lose control of their creations? Scary stuff.

Margaret Bowland

Daniel Maidman

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Explain again why you don’t want to be pictured in any photographs of your collection.

The paintings in my home do not belong to me; they belong to the artists who created them, and I am merely their transitory caretaker. You can use this last sentence in lieu of my photograph.

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Randel Shadid

DANIEL MAIDMAN: What type or types of art do you like to collect, and who are a few artists you're particularly proud to have in your collection?

RANDEL SHADID: I collect all types of art (oil, watercolor and pastel), landscape, seascape, figurative, wildlife, still life, abstract, sculpture, and pueblo pottery). I am proud to have all the artists I own in my collection. Who an artist is in the pecking order of fame is relevant but I never buy a piece I do not love and want to live with till the end of my time on earth. But you asked for a few names so here goes. Kenny McKenna, Dick and Susan Evans, Kyle Polzin, Dan Gerhartz, Dan Sprick, Mian Situ, David Leffel, Poteet Victory, David Pearson, Albert Handel, Andre Kohn, George Hallmark, Jim Vogel, Bruce Cody, Pamela Wilson, Sara Bienvenue, Laura Robb, Markey Robinson, Keli Folsom, Katherine Stone, Quang Ho, Greg Reiche, Tony Hochstetler and Kevin Box. I could go on as I not only love the artist’s work but know many of them personally as friends.

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DM: Can you tell me a bit about how your involvement with art began? Was it an encounter with art in childhood, or through family or school?

RS: My involvement in art came later in life. I always had an appreciation for beauty but had never acquired original art until I was in my late 40’s (I am 69 going on 39). My wife Dana convinced me to spend a long weekend in Santa Fe. I was not excited as I was not interested in purely “cowboy and Indian” subject matter. Dumb statement. Discovered all kinds and styles of art. Wound up spending $15,000 on paintings for a historic building I was rehabbing for a law office. The rest as they say is history as my obsessive personality took over. Dana and I have acquired several hundred works of art since then. I subscribed to several art publications, visited with gallery owners whose works appealed to me and visited more museums to enhance what little I knew about art in order to gain a better appreciation.

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DM: Describe a little bit the role that art plays in your life. I say "a little bit" because I suspect that for any real art lover, the answer can never be completed. So just a few thoughts on how art influences who you are and the life you live.

RS: Art has a great influence in and on my life. Art is the first thing I see in the morning and the last thing I see at night. Each piece has a story and each piece in its own way makes me feel happy and more alive. Over the years as we have been blessed to travel we look for art that is affordable but representative of the areas we visit. The artwork always reminds us of a great day. We also try to support artists, particularly young ones trying to support themselves through their talent. I learned a long time ago that I did not get the gift my artist friends have. But if they are going to succeed someone has to acquire their wonderful works. Guess I was lucky to get that gift. I tell my friends I will never be able to retire because all my retirement is hanging on the walls or sitting on a pedestal. As long as I have my eyesight I will be a happy boy. 

With others, I also helped start a public art program in Edmond, OK. We have around 190 works in the public collection. I am a former Mayor and Council member. When I retired from political life, establishing a public program became my mission. The success of the program through the support of our city council and citizens has raised both the aesthetic and the civility of our community. Selfishly I get to enjoy all those public pieces as I walk around our community. I also take great satisfaction in watching mothers and grandmothers with children and tourists reacting with public art and having a Kodak moment. Makes me proud of our citizens and happy we supported so many different artists.

DM: This is a fascinating range of answers, and it captures for me a lot of the complexity of having a relationship with art: you describe it in terms of an aesthetic appreciation of beauty, and as a series of sign-posts marking the road of your own personal history, and as a means of civic betterment. Are there any other major virtues you see in art? And could you choose a piece in your collection that has both extraordinary aesthetic and personal importance for you, and share its "case history"? I think our readers can be trusted to take it that you might have chosen any number of works, and that this one stands, for the sake of brevity, for all.

RS: Other virtues I see in art: I was recently visiting with Steve and Elizabeth Harris of Insight Gallery and Steve reminded me of something I told him a few years ago. We were discussing why we collect art and I said “After a long difficult day at work I can sit in any room of my home look at wonderful art and it relaxes me. It takes me away either to the place depicted in the painting or a special moment when we purchased the piece and got to know the artist or the gallery staff. Always evokes pleasant thoughts or memories. Blood pressure drops 20 points.

A single piece of art: It is tough to pick a single piece that has extraordinary aesthetic and personal importance because they all do. The one I will discuss is an abstract landscape (at least that is what I think it is) by Dick Evans of Santa Fe. I purchased the painting nearly 20 years ago before I knew Dick. His gallery rep Joyce Robins offered to take Dana and me and 3 other Edmond, OK couples to Dick and Susan Evans’s home and studio. We expected to be there 30 minutes, have a glass of wine and leave. Two or three hours later we were in Dick’s studio participating in a buying frenzy. Next thing we knew Dick was cooking us dinner. I am drawn to landscapes but at that time was not a fan of abstract work. But this painting grabbed me. The palate and form were beautiful and took my mind to another place. We subsequently became great friends with Dick and Susan. Several years ago they were at our home. We were sipping wine and Dick leaned over and said, “Randel, I am going to make you an offer you can’t refuse. If you will let me have that painting back you can come to the studio and pick any painting any size in its place”. I smiled, leaned over and said, “Dick, I love you, but you are not getting that painting back.” We are still friends. The painting is a joy to view but the story is an affirmation of beauty on a panel or canvas and beginning of a meaningful relationship that resulted in a lifelong friendship. I have placed several of Dick’s paintings and Susan’s sculptures in our public art collection in Edmond, OK. I see the art every day and it always reminds me of a great time with my friends sharing a meal, talking about art and embellishing tales.

Daniel Maidman

Daniel Maidman is best known for his vivid depiction of the figure. Maidman’s drawings and paintings are included in the permanent collections of the Library of Congress, the New Britain Museum of American Art, and the Long Beach Museum of Art. His art and writing on art have been featured in PoetsArtists, ARTnews, Forbes, W, Juxtapoz, Hyperallergic, American Art Collector, and Manifest. He writes art criticism for The Huffington Post, art instruction for International Artist, and is a repeat guest critic at the New York Academy of Art. His first book of drawings, Daniel Maidman: Nudes, is available from Griffith Moon Publishing. He is represented by Jenn Singer Gallery in New York. He lives and paints in Brooklyn, New York.

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Robert Shiell

Interviewed by Daena Title

Technically, art collector Robert Shiell lives by himself in his Los Angeles English country cottage style house, but you couldn’t say he lives alone.  His walls are alive with figurative paintings, chock-a-block with both Subjects and the Spirit of the artists who made them. 

Daena Title standing next to Robert as he points to new work he has not yet unpacked.Behind on the walls are works by, at left, Hope Gangloff, and at right, Dan McCleary.

Over 140 works crowd the walls of Shiell’s two homes, (Shiellhas also renovated a mid century modern 50’s house in Palm Springs). More work overflows onto the floor of his living room waiting its turn to be unpacked and enjoyed. Though Shiell has sporadically collected paintings over the years, and inherited others, it’s only been eight years since he began his deep dive into the world of emerging figurative artists.  Already his collection has outgrown the walls of his homes. So much so, that on the advice of a friend, Shiell recently converted his LA garage into an “Art Room”: Shiell’s own white box gallery and entertainment space. “If I had one room between the two houses,” says Shiell. “It would be this one that means the most to me.  I am happy with every piece in this room. I like every painting on every square inch here and I wish I had triple the space”.

In the past Shiell has collected American ceramics and mid-century furniture as well as vintage Disney collectibles, but his present passion, is paintings. His figurative art collection throws a wide net. Paintings range from the “technical brilliance” of realists like Brian Drury and Ain Cocke to expressionistic rule breakers like Andrew Salgado, to the even more abstract Sojourner Truth Parsons.  Many works compress the picture plane, or slyly promise a traditional composition and then discombobulate instead.  Still others hew to the more traditional approach. Shiell connects equally to his four paintings by male artist Jason Yarmosky as he does to the two pieces he owns by female artist Hope Gangloff. He collects Americans and Europeans.  He collects the young such as Anja Salonen, still in undergraduate school at the time of Shiell’s purchase, and the old, 75 year old Katherine Bradford and Margot Bergman whom Shiell tells me is ”only getting her due at 83”. What connects them all is that each piece must “resonate” with Shiell. “I am not in this for the investment”.

On a recent tour of his collection, Shiell ‘s descriptions radiated warmth, passion and his connection to each purchase. His heart is open to all facets of the work: either reveling in the color, “I just love, love, love orange”, or the beauty and technique of the works themselves, or in the sometimes serpentine road to acquisition, or the stories behind the subjects depicted, “This one is head of the Kabalah.  It hasn’t been confirmed if it’s a wig or not,” as well as in the artists themselves as individuals: artist Gangloff, for example “turns music on in her studio and she’ll dance in the studio and go back and forth from one thing to another in this rhythm and dance from painting to painting”. One artist from whom he’s purchased, died too young.  Another painting’s Subject was in the middle of a break up.  Every painting has its stories and Shiell loves them all.

Sheill standing next to his Andrew Salgado - See painting on Andrew Salgado's Artsy Page.

What follows are edited excerpts of our recent conversation at his LA home.

DT: You seem to enjoy getting to know these artists personally. 

RS: My relationship to the work is enriched by my friendship with the artists.  And I’m delighted if my purchases can help support them in their careers

DT: Do you ever buy art on line?

RS: Yes, but only after knowing the artist’s work and having seen other works.

Painting by Jason Yarmosky.

DT: You’ve mentioned during the tour that one of the artists has been “getting a lot of buzz” or that another ”has been making some waves. That Roberta Smith gave him a real positive review”.  Do you ever buy anything on impulse that you haven’t heard about previously, but just see it and love it?

RS: I have to viscerally respond to the work, but I don’t buy on impulse. I deliberate before buying anything. I have to know something about the artist.  Which is something I’m hearing about on blogs or this and that. I’ll follow an artist on line and do research.  There’s so much art out there that might appeal to me visually, I do consciously try to filter that out by doing some homework and just not going with my instincts. Every piece in here I did research on.  Read something about. And each painting resonates with me in a different way.

I’m not looking at it as an investment or thinking it’ll go up in value, but with some other young painters it is nice to get something where they’re considered very promising. I like the idea of being supportive of a younger artist’s career, mid-career artists, too.  But it’s sort of nice, being right .  And of course, it’s much more affordable. 

DT: Do you use Instagram?

RS: I have a lot of art and artists I follow on Instagram, but to be honest with you, I check it less frequently than I would like. Because I feel that I’m overwhelmed with the emails, with my art emails and the blogs.  I can’t be on both. Facebook, I dropped off. I just don’t have the time to find art on Instagram.

DT: The art market has gone through some big changes even within the relatively short time that you’ve been collecting.

RS: I get a little concerned about the new platforms for art.  I like buying on line because I can’t physically get to every gallery and I can have a relationship with a gallery that I might not be able to visit. I’m a little concerned that physical galleries are dying.  That really disturbs me.  And I think it’s a trend that might continue to happen.  Because a lot of younger people are relying on on-line art.  That sends less foot traffic to the galleries, so it’s cyclical.  Not all galleries know how to pull in a younger crowd and you need to not just have older people there.

DT: And Art Fairs?

RS: Galleries just have to do Art Fairs now.  You just have to. It’s very difficult not to. 

I like Art Fairs. This will be my fifth year at Art Basel in Miami.  It’s a fun thing. But what’s disturbing about the Art Fairs-- I feel there’s a lot more pressure on certain quote marketable artists to produce commercially. There’s this constant pressure for them to produce for the Fairs.

I hear this first hand from the Galleries I know—Oh this artist, they’re going to give me a couple of pieces for this Fair, or the Armory or Basel, China, the Summer show, the Spring Show. I think as an artist, you just need time, to take your time to paint, over the course of a year or so.  But this idea of having deadlines. If you’re having to be that prolific, you’re not spending as much time with the paintings. Your quality goes down if you’re constantly on a deadline.

DT: What will you do when all your walls are full?

RS: I have already run out of wall space.  I just got rid of my beautiful mid-century lamps in two of my bedrooms in Palm Springs in order to increase my wall space. 

I just acquired eight new artworks while in New York (last week) attending the Armory Art Fair, NADA Art Fair and Independent Art Fair, although I am out of wall space.  

I will have to get storage space and rotate my art… and maybe down the line buy a different house with significantly more wall space.

 DT: You have such a passionate connection to all of these paintings. Is there one that stands out for you?

RS: I don’t like to say I have a favorite. But the painting behind me is of my father who died two years ago in 2015 April. When he was 90 I asked the artist Jason Yarmosky, who is incredibly skilled at rendering elderly people, to paint my father. I paid for him to come down to San Diego and spend a day with my father.   And they had a great day together.  

My father wasn’t happy with the painting because he felt it made him look old. He wasn’t able to look at it and realize this is what he looked like today.   Even though Jason captured him perfectly. His eyes. His neck… I love the feel.

My father kept the painting at his place.  I wanted him to have it. 

So when my father did die, I had it hung here in my house and it really helped me during that grieving process. This room is where I sit all the time at my desk.  That’s where I sit more than any place and spend the most amount of time. And I really felt that it helped me having it. The grieving process takes different stages and it made it easier for me. I don’t know what the process of healing would have been without that painting behind me.  I love having it.

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Interviewed by Daena Title | March 2017

Photographs by Daena Title and Claire Matic

Video by Daena Title | Produced by Didi Menendez

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About Daena Title

Feminist painter Daena Title's colorist, expressionist work centers on the seductive force of modern female icons. Her work, which reflects the on-going love/hate relationship between women, societal standards, and self-esteem, has been shown in gallery and museum spaces since 1998, including recent group exhibitions at The Oceanside Museum, the Riverside Museum, the Torrance Art Museum and the LA Art Fair. Title is proud that her work has been showcased in several PoetsArtists publications and shows, is included in the Brooklyn Museum Elizabeth A. Sackler Center for Feminist Art Online Feminist Art base and the Tullman Collection of Chicago.  www.daenatitle.com